Thursday, December 06, 2012

Those Crazy Christians, Eh?

Of course, there is crazy and then there is crazy. Like a fox or like a fool.
Not that she is crazy, but one Christian suggested to me recently that the reason President Obama was re-elected was because Christians didn't do enough, pray enough.
I reject that; I believe that God, for His own purposes, left President Obama in power.
No matter how fervently we prayed or worked for his defeat, we accept evil from the hand of God as readily, as joyfully as we accept good. He is in charge, and if we pray and work against His plan, our efforts are futile. Better to pray, "Thy Will be done" and leave it at that.
I believe that God is getting this planet ready for judgement, is about to make things much worse rather than better. The re-election of President Obama might be a tiny part of that.
12Then the word of the LORD came to me saying, 
13“Son of man, if a country sins against Me by committing unfaithfulness, and I stretch out My hand against it, destroy its supply of bread, send famine against it and cut off from it both man and beast, 
14even though these three men, Noah, Daniel and Job were in its midst, by their own righteousness they could only deliver themselves,” declares the Lord GOD. Ezekiel 14:12-14

Note that the verse above doesn't mention Israel or Judah-"...if a country" sins against God by committing unfaithfulness-which could be said of our entire world-and God stretches out His hand against it...big time tribulations like you've never conceived. Like you can't imagine. Worse than that.
17“Or if I should bring a sword on that country and say, ‘Let the sword pass through the country and cut off man and beast from it,’ 
18even though these three men were in its midst, as I live,” declares the Lord GOD, “they could not deliver either their sons or their daughters, but they alone would be delivered. 
19“Or if I should send a plague against that country and pour out My wrath in blood on it to cut off man and beast from it, 
20even though Noah, Daniel and Job were in its midst, as I live,” declares the Lord GOD, “they could not deliver either their son or their daughter. They would deliver only themselves by their righteousness.” Ezekiel 14:17-20

Some Christians have maintained that God has blessed America because of our Christian heritage-we were settled by pilgrims, Christian men and women seeking religious freedom after being martyred and persecuted in Europe.
Righteousness is not a gift handed down from one generation to the next-and our generation is living in a country and world ripe for judgement.
If Noah, Daniel and Job were in OUR midst...they could only deliver themselves by their righteousness.
Long story short: God takes care of His children, and we Christians have nothing to fear.
God also promises to 'take care of' those who reject Him...and those people should be fearing bigtime.
Sure, it may sound crazy to non-Christians, that we trust in God. Call me crazy if you like-I think your time would be better spent seeking God's forgiveness. He still saves sinners...for now.


8 comments:

Doug said...

Recently I listened to a lecture on Lincoln's second inaugural address, called by some "Lincoln's Gospel message to the world".
The speaker was some high falutin' professor who specializes in both Lincoln and 19th century religion.
His conclusion was that Lincoln was not a Christian, though he did know how to speak the language.
I've read some Lincoln, both the speeches and other writings, and I think that Lincoln was indeed a Christian-I'll find out if I see him in Heaven.
If we think times are tough and getting tougher, we have had paradise compared to the state of our country in the 19th century.
We survived as a nation because God wanted us to survive. We are in His hands, whether that thought troubles you or not.
At this time, His Salvation is still available for all who seek to be forgiven of their sins. Don't wait until its too late. If all that I got out of being a Christian was the Peace that he has given me in this world....it would be plenty enough. But there is so much more, and I pray that you will seek Him and find out for yourself.

James said...

"God has blessed America because of our Christian heritage"

A heritage that involved that buying and selling of human beings for profit. An entire Christian denomination was founded upon the notion that slavery was a moral good, accepted and ordained by God. They eventually apologized ... in 1995. In the last century, over 90% of Americans believed interracial marriage was wrong, and we passed laws that enforced that view. We punished one couple by putting them in jail for the "crime" of loving someone of a different race. Even our churches were segregated at one point.


This is embarrassing. No reasonable person can look back at our history and suggest that there was some moral utopia that existed in 1850 or 1950.

Certainly, our society has its ills. However, I'd rather live in a society where a black man can be the President, however, than one in which the majority of citizens believe that God will he be shackled in their shed.

Doug said...

Hello James-I doubt that you will find any slave owners among the Puritans and pilgrims which came here in 1620.
"An entire Christian denomination was founded upon the notion that slavery was a moral good, accepted and ordained by God. They eventually apologized ... in 1995."
I have no idea which denomination you are talking about-please explain?
"In the last century, over 90% of Americans believed interracial marriage was wrong, and we passed laws that enforced that view. We punished one couple by putting them in jail for the "crime" of loving someone of a different race. Even our churches were segregated at one point."
Quite a statement-but I don't believe that 90% of Americans ever agreed on ANYTHING.
Such laws to forbid interracial marriage were put in force...by the racist Democrats of the last century and a half. Look up the laws you mention and I'm guessing that you will find a "D" after each legislator's name. My point being that the Republican party came into being as a anti-Slavery political party, and 'our side' doesn't care who marries who with regard to skin color.
Churches are segregated now, James.
By choice of congregants and church leaders. I don't think it's right. I am also certain that most churches in most denominations do not have a single actual Christian in them. Please don't tar me with the same brush-true Christians do not answer for the sins of faux Christians. Just because THEY may be racist and sexist and whatever elseist, it doesn't mean that we agree with THEM, or can be lumped together with them in a generalization.
"This is embarrassing. No reasonable person can look back at our history and suggest that there was some moral utopia that existed in 1850 or 1950."
You are assuming that you are reasonable, James. Look up the genesis of "Utopia" and find out what Christians have been fighting against for generations.
"Certainly, our society has its ills." You are right, James. And those ills are created by humans, sinners who sin and compound trouble upon themselves and each other. Christians (imperfectly) attempt to obey, trust love and honor God. We're not the ones causing the troubles. We follow a simple precept: What God calls sin, we call sin. What He says is wrong, we call wrong. The ills of society come from those who are NOT Christians. Basically...everyone else.

James said...

The denomination I was referring to was the Southern Baptist Convention.

http://www.yale.edu/glc/archive/1035.htm

From the SBC website:
"WHEREAS, Our relationship to African-Americans has been hindered from the beginning by the role that slavery played in the formation of the Southern Baptist Convention; and"

http://www.sbc.net/resolutions/amresolution.asp?id=899

Doug said...

Thank you, James. I went to the Yale page, and it was nothing like the SBC page-it had to do with a letter from someone in 1822? I went to the index of the Gilder Lehman Center at Yale and had no better luck.
Anywhooo-to be fair, rather than reading just one line of their collection of whereas statements, look at the entire page and see if you think they got it right.
Now here is an important point-you can continue to accuse them of racism for their history if you want. But is it fair to accuse them of racism from 1995 going forward? Even if you agree with every whereas on their page?

Bye the bye-did you look into "Utopia"? Sir Thomas More came up with a doozy of a social fantasy based on the idea that people are generally nice and agreeable and willing to work together for the common good.
Problem being that man is NOT nice, or agreeable, and has shown a propensity for making war and taking from his fellow man rather than working with him. Social-lies such as Communism and socialism and whatever we seem to be heading towards always degenerate into a power grab by those at the top. See Hugo Chavez, Bashir al Assad, Saddam Hussein, Lenin, Stalin, Chairman Mao, etc.etc.
Of course al Assad inherited his kingdom from his father, as did the current North Koren 'president'-it's amazing how in communist countries, where all are equal, the progeny of tyrants take over.

Lucia said...

You got it half right, Doug. We are hard-wired for both survival and empathy, and it's not hard to see why. (I won't dispute with you whether that wiring evolved, God put it there, or it got there some other way, since that's above my pay grade and beside my point.)

What do you think motivated the people who helped you unstick your truck?

Doug said...

Lu sez:
"What do you think motivated the people who helped you unstick your truck?"
Reading between the lines, as this post is about judgement on sinful people (and you commented here rather than the Samaritan post) you seem to be asking, "Doug, of people are so mean that God is going to clobber them, if they are SO evil...why did these guys go out of their way to help you?"

If I'm inferring more than you meant, Lu, please let me know-I wouldn't DARE put words in your mouth.

Long/short: we are made in the image of God, marred as it is by sin. Of Course we are kind and friendly and helpful and loving and willing to go the extra mile for a stranger! AND Christians do not have the "Kindness Market" cornered by any stretch. Every human being has some good in him-Hitler was a dog lover, for example.
As I said about kindness at the end of the other post: It makes for a happier world.
But the innate goodness of Mankind, you must admit, often gets minimized/tossed aside. There is evil in us also.
Country song from about ten years ago stated:
"Half of my blood is Cain's blood. Half of my blood is Abel's.
One eye looks to Heaven...one eye looks for trouble."
The absolute bestest nicest most honorable cuss to ever walk on dry land isn't good enough for Heaven. I'M not good enough for Heaven, and I'm not being false humble-I KNOW what a stinker I am. That's why I must depend on the Grace of God to get me there.
Yes Lu, people are good. I spent Thanksgiving Day with a full house of good people...I was the only Christian. I was the only Republican. And we got along just dandy. One mention of politics came up and I deflected the thrust by calling for Peace. And there was peace.

Lucia said...

Yes, that's what I meant, and yes, we are both good and evil. As I've said before, I don't believe any of us is bad enough to deserve eternal torment.

Say Hitler was responsible for 50 million deaths, and say he deserves a thousand years of infernal agony for each one. At the end of 50 billion years, he has no less days to scream his lungs out than when he'd first begun. And by your lights he would have the company of Mother Teresa, Oskar Schindler, Bill Maher, Bill O'Reilly, Bill Clinton, Mitt Romney, and my entire family.

I'll grant you that nobody deserves eternal bliss, either. The idea that we all go one place or the other is a very odd one when you think about it.